WorldsAway Acolyte Meeting - September 16th, 1995
Dan Kuschner in this conversation is Oracle Teresias. This wasn't a typical Acolyte meeting, but one to discuss an issue with the avatar named MarvL and his wanting to create a constitution for WorldsAway that was causing issues amongst the staff and the users.
********** 9/16/95 8:37 PM Forum CO Dan Kuschner | Okay, I would like to start the meeting now. Indigo <busy> | Need that Turf Man!!!! Dan Kuschner | <gavel falls> Marianne G (Busy) | OUCH! Nicci | LOL! | I was gonna say that\ Marianne G (Busy) | ;;he gets me every time!;; Dan Kuschner | This is not going to be a usual meeting. Ed | Uh oh.. Dan Kuschner | I have a few things to say to set the tone | and then we will have a | structured round circle meeting. | First, contrary to the rumor, this is not | going to be a tactical | planning meeting. | I am not expecting to solve any issues in | this one meeting. | This meeting is more to epmhisize that we are | a team with | common goals and vision. | Therefore, we will not be following the | normal queue method | tonight, but will go around the circle in a | manner I will describe | later. | Because the Konstitution issues are very | present in our thoughts, | I wanted to answer Moria's post. | (in absentia, I will post this immediately | after) | This has reached a point where the | consequences of the situation are that one | person is attempting to dictate to the | service. | The Oracles, as representatives of the | service, will deal with this issue in an | authoritative (not authoritarian) manner. | The Acolytes are aked to refrain exhibiting | authoritarian moves. | Let the Oracles take any heat which might be | generated. | The Oracles ask the Acolytes for their | support by continuing to maintain | communiations with the Oracles and offering | their observations and opinions. | Is there anyone who does not know what issue | I am talking about? Speak | now. | Last call. Milen | Well... Dan Kuschner | Yes? Milen | ...I've not read the file because I've not | gotten Acrobat Reader yet... | ...but I know MarvL, and I have a general | idea of what you're talking about. Dan Kuschner | That's good enough for now. | Anyone else? Marianne G (Busy) | I haven't read it either, but I have heard | excerpts :D Dan Kuschner | Let me describe the method in which the | meeting will be conducted. Marianne G (Busy) | Plus have seen many of his board posts | leading up to it Dan Kuschner | We will proceed in alphabetical order. | I will begin. With the floor, I will state | 2-3 sentences. | I will end my statement with <done>. | Then I will pass the floor to the next person. | They will speak 2-3 sentences. (Statements | or rhetorical questions only) Brynne <busy> | (Can I change my name to Zebra, please? ;D) Chameleon<busy>:) | no you dont!!!<G> Dan Kuschner | Once they send <done>, I will pass the floor | to the next person on the list. | Once a round is completed, I will comment as | Oracle. | Then I will take the floor as an equal and a | new round will begin. | Remember that all our words, once spoken, | have a life of their own and should be | spoken from the heart. Ravenwhyte (busy) | Awesome. Dan Kuschner | The floor passes to Dan. | I personally have been feeling pretty frayed | and some of it stems from the feeling | that we are drifting apart. | We alll seem to have the same basic idea, but | it feels we are splitting once we hit | the details. | I want to be able to give everyone wnat they | want and am trying to deal with the | reality that I can't. | <done> | The floor passes to Brynne. Brynne <busy> | I personally have been feeling very | frustrated, | because since I have been on this staff, I | haven't | really seen a lot of teamwork being displayed. | Sometimes I feel that we're all trying to | compete with | each other -- who's more of a leader than the | next. | And this disturbs me because I think we all | have | strengths that others may not have, and we | can | balance each other and bring out the BEST we | each | have to offer. <done> Dan Kuschner | The floor passes to Chameleon. Chameleon<busy>:) | although I know people invariably form | clinches among themselves, I am | sorry to see signs of people actually seeming | to put down their fellow | teammates. And I think our Oracles have been | stretched a bit thin, and | maybe we are sometimes a bit demanding | no they cant keep everybody happy, and | sometimes its easy to think me me | me and not whats its costing the one | providing, myself included<done> Dan Kuschner | The floor passes to Data. Data <Busy> | We all have our own opinion about various | things. It is SO hard to bring a | group this size in and find pure | harmony. The thing to do is not to look for | what is wrong with an idea | but... | maybe what is right with it. All of us have | some good ideas and I think | we need to keep up a positive attitude | always. Even in our lowest | moments. | <done> Dan Kuschner | The floor passes to Ed. Ed <Busy> | I think that we should all start by making | sure that we show | each other as much common coertesy that we | ca... | Even in our bad moments and...We should all | respect each | other as peers | Not as leaders or followers, we must work | together as one | We all have varied talents that maek up the | whole | And to diminish that in any way hurts all of | us <done> Dan Kuschner | The floor passes to Electra. Electra | Perhaps I am too naieve, or too blind, but I | have always felt | that I have been treated well by each and | every one on the | staff. Everyone contributes in their own | way, which is what | a team is, after all. | <done> Dan Kuschner | The floor passes to the bride. <g> Indigo <busy> | At the top of our inworld organization right | now are our dear | Oracles who are struggling worse than we are. | And as | swamped and overloaded. This trickles | down..... and we | Acolytes in Kymer, are mystified at all the | difficulties we face | and the seeming necessity laid upon us to | create an | environment for the good of humankind and as | a foundation for | the future. In my opinion, this is a result | of it being a | commercial venture. The Oracles are doing | their best. They | care. We need to support them by supporting | each other. | <done> Dan Kuschner | The floor passes to Libra. Indigo <busy> | <smile> Libra (busy) | I am increasingly frustrated by the fact that | we are letting our emotions get in the way of | ourselves. | We all have emotions and strong ones (me | included) but we need to be able to let our | emotions play themselves out before reacting | to the world and to each other. | <done> Dan Kuschner | The floor passes to Marianne. Marianne G (Busy) | I don't want to feel like I have to fight | with my friends, | and you all are my friends. If I knew you | before, if | I've only known you shortly, when I sign on | to a | team, I sign on to be part of a team. We all | want the | same goal, I know it. We are all people with | ideas, | opinions and different ways of dealing with | issues. | Life is finding a way to deal with, | compromise on, | give and take on issues so the common goals | are | met. I respect everyone here, and optimist | that I am, | I KNOW there is a workable solution to | everything. | We just can't always see it. <done> Dan Kuschner | The floor passes to Milen. Milen | Can't think of much to say. Struggling to | keep up with reading all this. | Go on without me. Dan Kuschner | The floor passes to Mysteria. Mysteria | First, I like you all so very much. <s> But | sometimes I sense some competition among the | staff over who is the "best" Acolyte, or | the one who organizes the most games, etc. | That has left me feeling exhausted and upset, | and I did not want to "burn out," | so I took much of this week off. I hope | others will feel it's okay to do the same | when they need to. <done> Dan Kuschner | The floor passes to Nicci. Nicci (busy) | I came online yesterday after spending the | week away | from here and I litterally felt lost. I felt | like such an | outsider and all I could think of was how | stupid this | was. After a couple of conflicts and hurt | feelings I | found out that I wasn't the only person who | felt like this | and the others didn't miss a week like I did. | I think we | have comunication problems within our group | and the | result is that people feel alienated. It's | all | misunderstandings but the real result is that | people | are getting hurt. We really need to pull | together. The | burn out thing is a big thing too. People are | pushing | too hard. <done> Dan Kuschner | The floor passes to Ravenwhyte. Ravenwhyte (busy) | I wish that all the others from our team were | here, and I apprecite this intimate forum | where all voices may be heard. I feel torn | between what is viewed as a business at the | Fujitsu angle, yet has nothing to do with | business on a personal level. | We are all to a great extent in the same | boat, we are all asked to take risks | We are all networked. | As servants of Kymer, we are asked to pu the | good of the community before our own personal | desires. | <done> Dan Kuschner | The floor passes to Rosaleah. Rosaleah <busy> | :: sorry, thinking ... :: ;) | I think (heh) what I want to say is that I | wish we'd all talk to each other more ... | to remember to help each other as much as we | would any avatar out there. What's going | on in the World? Anybody to keep an eye on? | Someone need special attention/help? | And what sorts of things are working well for | you ... they'll likely work well for others | too. I, | for one, appreciate the sharing. <done> Dan Kuschner | Commentary as Oracle: | Though each of us, Oracles included, feel | frustrated because our desire for | efficient control cannot be fulfilled, our | greatest contribution to the strength of the | team is our own sincerity. | I thank you for sharing tonight. | Constructing a consensual evolution of even | the most worthwhile vision is not | easy. | It requires mutual respect and an emphasis on | cooperation, not competition. | By not focusing on competition, it is | possible to meet mutually exclusive goals | such as business and building the vision of | community. | The next round may be used to air views | regarding the MarvL/Konsitiution | situation. | The floor passes to Dan (as participant). | As frustrating as he can be and as far as | this has gone, I deeply feel there is a lot | of good and growth for the community which | can come from this. | That's been my light at the end of the tunnel. | <done> | The floor passes to Brynne. Brynne <busy> | ::thinking here ... one moment please:: | On the Marv situation: my only emotion here | is a | deep concern about his dictatorial style and | its | overall effect on the future of WA. | I know he is a great motivator, and if his | energy | could be channeled in a more positive | direction, I | think he would be good for WA. | Unfortunately, however, I believe he is a | manipulator | and will tell someone anything just to get | that | person off his real goal. As a result, I feel | Marv is | actually a danger to the future of WA. <done> Dan Kuschner | The floor passes to Chameleon. Chameleon<busy>:) | I think this meeting has been the best thing | that has happened in a long | time here! especially the way it is being | done. I am not worried about MarvL | but what he is doing. He seems to like | causing us to be at odds more than | anything else. Surely we can band closer | together, and not let something | like this seperate us further. I am sure this | is the first of many such | problems. <done> Dan Kuschner | The floor passes to Data. Data <Busy> | I am unclear on whether MarvL's intent is to | get a rise out of us or he has | blinded himself into believing FCT is just | going to hand the service over | to him. Whatever the case, I am not going to | let it bother me. I have faith | in the Oracles that the situation will be | handled correctly. He is a | customer and I will give him that respect | always. | <done> Dan Kuschner | The floor passes to Ed. Ed <Busy> | I think that we should let the citizens | decide what they want, after | all, we are in their service | I also believe that Marv's ideas could create | a lot of growth | But I just don't feel comfortable with the | way he words things | and | The way he goes about them | It's my opinion that he is very subversive | We should concentrate on sticking together | instead of MravL | Marv! oops! | We must also remember that he is also a | customer.. But.. | I don't think we should just hand him | everything he wants on a | silver platter | We should let the citizens decide what they | want ..... that's the | bottom line <done> Dan Kuschner | The floor passes to Electra. Electra | I find it almost incomprehensible that a | single person can be | the focus of so much time and energy. I | wonder if it's not | the attention that he feeds on? And is | anyone besides the | Oracles and Acolytes paying any serious | attention to him | and his dictates? <done> Dan Kuschner | The floor passes to Indigo. Indigo <busy> | As soon as the ability to have * more* than | acceptable or | agreed upon power over others, as this seems | to have turned | into for MarvL, predominates, all | civilizations start to deteriorate | and the original purpose becomes buried. As | this civilization is | both altruistic and commercial, we need to | find a solution which | accommodates MarvL as a customer, but is firm | in direction for | the good of all the community. | <done> Dan Kuschner | The floor passes to Libra. Libra (busy) | I have been personally very frustrated by the | MarvL situation. On the one hand he is a | tremendous source of good...helping newbies | inworld and out, creating one of the best | entertainments in town (Town Criers), | generating excellent debate in the forum, and | most importantly having an alter ego (Avatar | #2) who in my opinion is an excellent | citizen of the community. | On the other hand, he has used some tactics | which are underhanded and suggest an | ulterior motive which for the life of me I | can't figure out (my main frustration is | that). | So, what I have been trying to do is harness | the beast in him by befriending him | (legitimately, I consider him a friend) and | trying to understand him. Let me say I am no | more enlightened now than I was before, but I | hate to say this...I like him. He may be a | PITA, but he can be a very enjoyable person | to be with. <sigh> Libra's don't take well to | this. | <done> Dan Kuschner | The floor passes to Mairanne. Marianne G (Busy) | What if they hold an election and no one | comes? | Would you vote for a dictatorship? If | phrased in | glowing terms perhaps. BUT, would you then | spend time in that kind of oppresive society? | I don't | think so. So what happens if he holds the | election | and nothing changes? Win, lose or draw, | nothing | changes? I mean, someone can say they have | the | power, but when they do not have the | mechanism | for power, ie: tools to run the community, | who is | going to pay attention to what you say? No | election | is going to give him what he seeks. As for | what he | WANTS, if it's attention, he certainly has | it :D I don't | see him as a threat, because I don't see his | election being anything more then | entertainment. If | he manages to cause disent in our ranks, | among | us, when before we were so perfectly meshed, | then | he has created a loss far greater then giving | him | actual power could. That is the only threat I | see from | him. <done> Dan Kuschner | The floor passes to Milen. Milen | MarvL. What can I say? He's smart. He's | clever. He's funny. His | arguments cause headaches in laboratory | studies. And he's | oh-so-sneaky. I could tell you a story about | that, but I cannot safely | relate it from this idenity. But, from | someone who knows: beware, beware, | beware. <done> Dan Kuschner | The floor passes to Mysteria. Mysteria | Well, I think MarvL is nuttier than a | fruitcake -- which is his right. <g> | However, he doesn't have the right to impose | his vision | on everyone else. I don't think 99.9% of | avatars are interested in his Konstitution, | or any kind of WA government. <done> Dan Kuschner | The floor passes to Nicci. Nicci (busy) | I agree with Mysteria. Sure customers have | rights and so MarvL | has rights... | but I've already read a message speaking out | against the need | for the Konstitiution.... | the avarage customer is going to have no need | for it... | and so we just have to keep MarvL in check so | that they are not | effected by his politics. I don't know. I | don't think anyone can | control MarvL <done> Dan Kuschner | The floor passes to Ravenwhyte. Indigo <busy> | Ravenwhyte gracefully terminated for the | moment, sorry. Ravenwhyte (busy) | I do not know MarvL well, so I am not in the | front line with him as yet. I am willing to | take a more active role in engaging him | positively, but would appreciate some | direction to that end. I admire his passion, | but am challenged, at times, to respect Indigo <busy> | He did indeed crash - those lines made it up | there as it was | happening. He'll BRB! Ravenwhyte | Sorry, HDD spindown | to respect the way he chooses to channel that | passion | I believe he has a place in our growing | community | But it is ever so difficult to draw the line | between the good of the few and the good of | the many. | Not an easy job, I tip my hat. <done> Dan Kuschner | The floor passes to Rosaleah. Rosaleah <busy> | I'm surprised that the community hasn't | challenged MarvL's ideas more. For instance, | I've been waiting for someone to propose an | alternate "Konstitution" and gov't plan ... | even a *very silly* one (actually, | *especially* a silly one). But the whole | gov't plan idea is | rather a pre-emptive one right now -- | proposed way too soon for most to have a good | sense of what's being proposed / done. The | World, after all, is just beginning...and | most | are far, far more interested in fun than in | governments...and he's taking advantage of | that. I wholeheartedly agree that he seems to | want to divide us ... and to crave gobs and | gobs of attention ... attention stolen, in | the long run, from the many, many other | customers of the service. I _do_ think he's | delusional if he really thinks FCT is going | to | just hand over the running of the service | over to him. I don't fear *that* for a | minute! | I wish I knew how to turn his energy into | something more positive ... but I fear I | don't have | a handle on that at all. <done> Dan Kuschner | Commentary as Oracle: | It's pretty clear that we recognize that | someone like MarvL has two aspects: That | of community participant and that of | potential serious threat. | Our response should be to encourage the | community participant while protecting | our community from potential serious threat | at the same time. | Our primary defense is that of the | cohesiveness of our community, particularly | the Acolytes and Oracles as caretakers. | Correction: Our primary strength is our | cohesiveness. | There are enough seemingly exclusive aspects: | we should think on what | everyone has said for now. | I intend to have a personal talk with MarvL | next chance I catch him in the world. | We can use the next round to state any | intentions we may have and care to | share. | The floor passes to Dan (as participant). | I intend to be in the world more, both | officially and socially, to try to strengthen | my ties to the community. | When I feel my frustration rising, I intend | to remember the solidarity showed in | tonight's meeting. | <done> | The floor passes to Brynne. Brynne <busy> | My desire is a simple one. I would like to | see us all | functioning as a *real* team. To that end, I | plan to be | as supportive of each of you as I would like | you to be | of me. <done> Dan Kuschner | The floor passes to Chameleon. Chameleon<busy>:) | <picturing Oracle Teresias as he spreads | himself thinner and thinner>. I feel | so good about this meeting tonight, and | appreciate each and every one of | you views that have been shared with me and | all of us. I too will think of this | meeting when I feel down and disassociated, | and will remember I do have | friends here. | As to Marv, I will continue to do what I have | been doing. | Kill him with kindness | its seems to have the desired effect<EG> | <done> Dan Kuschner | The floor passes to Data. Data <Busy> | I believe in the potential of our team.... | I believe working together we can accomplish | anything.... | My highest goal is to work hard with our team | and to do all I can to help | us bond together.... | Remember the old addage, "United we stand, | divided we fall". Indigo <busy> | To have the Oracles more inworld and more | accessible will | help to disseminate the tension. We should | together give that | as much positive attention and support as | possible, drawing | the focus away from any serious negative | effects from | MarvL's behavior. By offering the gold | pieces of positive | communal effort, the pennies of negative | attention will be | dropped. Yes, killing with kindness | everywhere... way to go! Data <Busy> | If I can do anything to help PLEASE tell me. | If I have any needs I'll do | likewise... | let's just always be there for each other. | <done> Indigo <busy> | <Oh no, sorry...> Dan Kuschner | The floor passes to Ed. Ed <Busy> | I intend to keep my loyalties where they | belong, with all of you | and with the citizens of Kymer, as I have in | the past | It is my intention to continue with | everything I have doneto this | point | doneto=doing Chameleon<busy>:) | they really are married now, Indi is | finishing his sentences!!>sorry had to say | it> Ed <Busy> | And to expand on it as much as possible. | And to each and every one of you I extend my | helping hand if it is | needed | Just ask | And I'll be there if I can | <done> Chameleon<busy>:) | oops wrong box<sigh> my appoligies Ed I am so | sorry. Ed <Busy> | LOL!!! | No problem! | I'm easy to get along with | It happens Dan Kuschner | The floor passes to Electra. Electra | I intend to make sure that my words and | actions always | reflect well upon the Oracles, the Acolytes, | and the | community. I will do whatever is within my | power to help | each and every one of you in whatever way I | can. I don't | know what more any of us can do but to pledge | to do our | best. <done> Dan Kuschner | The floor passes to Indigo. Marianne G (Busy) | Data, wasn't that a song? (One I now can't | get out of | my head). Anyway, I'm working on fitting in | a | scheduled time for assorted word and other | games, | called LETS TRY IT (or will work on that | title) to work | out various games for the community. As you | know, | with my memory leak, I need it to be a set | time each | week, cause otherwise I forget. I hope that | you'll | help with input, assistance running, if | needed, etc, | and in turn, the events will be worked out | and when | working, be available for all to use inworld. | I truly | believe that when we are seen as workers, | helpers, friends, in the community, that it | will | strenghten not only us with each other, but | the | community with us, and keep things like this | current | situation from ever reaching this point. | Drat, sorry, was not suppose to hit enter | ;;sigh;; Dan Kuschner | The floor is still with Indigo. Indigo <busy> | <grinning sheepishly> To have the Oracles | more inworld will | be awesome! We'll drop those dark old | pennies, and so will | the rest of the community. (scroll up to | read my original | statement). | Our strength is in our commitment to the good | of all and to | each other! <done> Dan Kuschner | The floor passes to Libra. Libra (busy) | I promise four things (1) To stop being such | a control freak and relax a | little...I can't be involved in every | situation everywhere (2) To continue to | trust you all as friends as teammates...that | means assuming that | whatever you say to me is meant in a spirit | of friendship and team spirit | (3) To continue to speak honestly about how I | see the world but making | sure it comes across in the spirit of | frinedship and team spirit it is | meant and (4) To sit back, watch and listen | more...taking my time | before reacting (5) To stop enumerating | lists of things all the time (I am | beginning to annoy myself with this too) (6) | To take a lesson in | mathematics...this was six I promised four | <g>. | Go team! | <done> Dan Kuschner | The floor passes to Marianne. Marianne G (Busy) | It is almost 2 in the morning for me people. | I beg | forgivness :D Anyway, what I said before, | and | before I go to sleep, I hope we have many, | many | years together as friends and workers and | think that | if you add cornstarch, it thickens things up, | and | maybe we can add them to the Oracles blood | and | they won't be spread so thin? <done> Dan Kuschner | The floor passes to Milen. Milen | Well, yesterday and today were two of the | worst days I've ever had. I | crashed *so* many times it was surreal. It | was about on a level with those | early, dark, pre-revision beta days, except | that this time I was the only one | crashing. I felt so alone, so left behind, | and so *frustrated*. I came | awsomely close to just dropping out right now | and resigning it was getting | so bad. In fact, I would have except for | just a few things. Their names are | Data, Indigo, Nicci, Ravenwhyte, VIQer.... | You all got me through a rough | time. I'm sure that we can handle anything | that comes our way, and, | wallet willing, I'm all set to forge ahead. | MarvL? Bring'em on! I eat three | MarvL's for breakfast! | <done> Dan Kuschner | The floor passes to Mysteria. Mysteria | I intend to focus my WA activities on | generating fun -- for those around me, and | for myself. I hope we'll all guard against | allowing Acolytehood to become a chore, and | try to keep perspective on its role in our | lives. | This IS supposed to be fun, right? <s> | <done> Dan Kuschner | The floor passes to Nicci. Nicci (busy) | Back to the communication breakdown issue. We | need to work | on this because MarvL assumes that we don't | have | communicaion between us. He tries to work on | us individually. | And when we prove him wrong and stand by each | other he turns | it around so it looks like MarvL vs. the | Acolytes (which in a lot of | ways it is but that is not becuase of the the | title, but becuase we | are the ones encountering problems with him | most frequently | since we are so active in the world). We need | to really plan | ahead and keep each other informed on this | issue. We have to | have at least an appearece of unity when | MarvL appoaches us | each indiviudally. We really need to think | ahead and to | communicate with each other <done> Dan Kuschner | The floor passes to Ravenwhyte. Ravenwhyte | I am so glad to know you all better through | your sincere sharing. Please do not ever | hesitate to call on me for help. | It cannot be truly understood what it takes | to support the community as we do until we | have walked here, in these Halls together | (huh? <g>). | I hope to continue to represent us as we are, | servants of the community . . . (Have I got | VC claening detail again?) | And dang! is this fun! | <done> Dan Kuschner | The floor passes to Rosaleah. Rosaleah <busy> | I, too, appreciate the sharing tonight, very | much. And offer my helping hand (and Razz's | too) whenever and wherever I can. <done> Dan Kuschner | (Final) Commentary as Oracle: | I want to thank you all for participating in | this different meeting tonight. | It showed that we are, indeed, a team with | common goals and vision. | I feel better. | One last thing: I want to thank Oracle Uni | who has guided me through this new | experience tonight. | (Uni waves) Data <Busy> | Hi UNI! <f^> Ed <Busy> | ::::;Waving at Uni:::::::: Dan Kuschner | Meeting done, kaput, fini! Rosaleah <busy> | <F6> <F6> Uni Mysteria | Hi Uni! <F6> Ravenwhyte | Awesome!! Hiya Uni! F7 Ed <Busy> | Best one we have had yet! Indigo <busy> | Hi UNI <Waving happily> Chameleon<busy>:) | <waving gratefully> needed this kind of a | meeting Milen | By, Uni! Electra | greetings, Uni <F6> <F7> <F6> Libra (busy) | <--------------------A very happy Libra...